2smooth2shout:

no. it went terribly wrong when SANDF went in alone and normalized after Zimbabwe and Botswana came to your rescue. i know the history very well

Funny I know people that were there. They don't seem to recale botswan or zim rescuing any body. Or doing any thing of note at all. SA moved and ended the coup.

Mike..ZA:
. You're highly mistaken. "
The "bull horn" formation
Most historians credit Shaka with initial
development of the famous "bull horn"
formation.[17] It was composed of three
elements:
1. The main force, the "chest," closed with the
enemy Impi and pinned it in position. The
warriors who comprised the "chest" were
senior veterans.[18]
2. The "horns," while the enemy Impi was
pinned by the "chest," would flank the Impi
from both sides and encircle it; in conjunction
with the "chest" they would then destroy the
trapped force. The warriors who comprised the
"horns" were young and fast juniors.[18]
3. The "loins," a large reserve, was placed,
seated, behind the "chest" with their backs to
the battle. The "loins" would be committed
wherever the enemy Impi threaten to break
out of the encirclement.[18]
Coordination was supplied by regimental
" izinduna" (chiefs or leaders) who used hand
signals and messengers. The scheme was
elegant in its simplicity, and well understood
by the warriors assigned to each echelon." Now counter this by showing me,any hausa,yuroba or Igbo invented battle tactic.

As it turns out, this is one of the most respected strategies in "ancient" Africa.

The Zulu handed the British one of their heaviest defeats in those years.

Naai-geria wouldn't know anything about that, surely.

CraigB:

As it turns out, this is one of the most respected strategies in "ancient" Africa.

The Zulu handed the British one of their heaviest defeats in those years.

Naai-geria wouldn't know anything about that, surely.

To be fare that loss was so bad the brits attacked with a massive force and completly subjecatored the zulu kingdom.

andrewza:

To be fare that loss was so bad the brits attacked with a massive force and completly subjecatored the zulu kingdom.

That they did. They learnt a great lesson at Sanhlwana (sp?) however.

Given that this was at the peak of their military power, it goes to show that even the greatest make mistakes.

let me clear all south africans on an issue.. Since 1960, Nigerian has been experiencing tribal and regional fuss, but nevertheless, we have shown the world that truelly, our UNITY IS PERFECTLY HIDDEN IN OUR DIVERSITY!.The 'disunited' Nigerian military waded into the liberian/sierra leone wars nd fought for 10 years(1990-2000) as ecomog. The military recorded huge success despite being under sanction. More than 9000 'disunited' Nigerian soldiers took path in those wars(operation 'death before dishonour' had already taken place at mammy yoko hotel where a 'disunited' nigerian platoon withstood a sierra leonian rebel force of 3000 men). In 1983, a 'disunited' nigerian army repelled an invading chadian military units than has occupied 13 nigerian islands off chad basins, recapturing the islands in a duo-service operations(army and airforce), they went on to seize 21 chadian islands, only to return them back. In 1993, after a little military skirmishes with cameroun,a 'disunited' Nigerian 3 brigade attacked, occupied and possessed the bakassi peninsular, repelling all camerounian army(with the french help) attempts to retake the bakassi peninsular thus began a 19-year long occupation of the bakassi peninsular. This 'DISUNITED' Nigeria can and will wage war on any element that threatens its sovereignity.

There are no cowards in South Africa, Naai-gerian losers. The region has seen real wars and has a legacy as long as your dreams of gianthood.

LT SHANGY: let me clear all south africans on an issue.. Since 1960, Nigerian has been experiencing tribal and regional fuss, but nevertheless, we have shown the world that truelly, our UNITY IS PERFECTLY HIDDEN IN OUR DIVERSITY!.The 'disunited' Nigerian military waded into the liberian/sierra leone wars nd fought for 10 years(1990-2000) as ecomog. The military recorded huge success despite being under sanction. More than 9000 'disunited' Nigerian soldiers took path in those wars(operation 'death before dishonour' had already taken place at mammy yoko hotel where a 'disunited' nigerian platoon withstood a sierra leonian rebel force of 3000 men). In 1983, a 'disunited' nigerian army repelled an invading chadian military units than has occupied 13 nigerian islands off chad basins, recapturing the islands in a duo-service operations(army and airforce), they went on to seize 21 chadian islands, only to return them back. In 1993, after a little military skirmishes with cameroun,a 'disunited' Nigerian 3 brigade attacked, occupied and possessed the bakassi peninsular, repelling all camerounian army(with the french help) attempts to retake the bakassi peninsular thus began a 19-year long occupation of the bakassi peninsular. This 'DISUNITED' Nigeria can and will wage war on any element that threatens its sovereignity.

You can't clear anything up.

I point you to Boko Haram.

That alone tells us you're talking nonsense.

People are dying by the dozen!

CraigB:

You can't clear anything up.

I point you to Boko Haram.

That alone tells us you're talking nonsense.

People are dying by the dozen!

boko haram is now in near-extinct. Since Nigeria launched a major military offences code-named 'OPERATION BOYONA', boko haram can only hit soft targets nw(when was the last time you heard abt church bombing?). The good news is that malam shekau has been deposed of, he is at the point of death as we speak after been shot at by his own men. Thats a military victory, my brother.

andrewza:

What failures? Even CAR is a succses,

actually you failed cos Africa signed a defence co-operation memorandum of understanding with the CAR in 2007. “This followed decisions of the AU Peace and Stability council for its member states ‘in the name of African solidarity’ to assist with post conflict recovery of that country”. Bozize was over thrown, your troops were killed in high numbers and your equipments taken from you, you fled and chickened out from retaliating.

that's failure, not success.

andrewza:
Hell they did not even ocupy it after we left.

you mean this base. they secured the base, ransacked it and drove your equipments around... they defeated you big time

LT SHANGY:
boko haram is now in near-extinct. Since Nigeria launched a major military offences code-named 'OPERATION BOYONA', boko haram can only hit soft targets nw(when was the last time you heard abt church bombing?). The good news is that malam shekau has been deposed of, he is at the point of death as we speak after been shot at by his own men. Thats a military victory, my brother.

We've heard this song a million times. It's become tired and tiring.

The bombs and bullets will continue to ring out all the way into infinity. You've killed a Boko leader before. It stopped nothing. As it is, you're giving us your wishes.

And don't let me pull out links about GEJ's very recent request for the military to find "new ways" to deal with they issue.

There's no victory. You can't get rid of the disunity problem, even if Shekau were to die. It's deep-rooted.

andrewza:
Let say there is a judo match. One win by pushing the other out of the ring but but the victor had his leg broken doing it.

so who goes home with the trophy and is regarded a winner? the victor with the broken leg that managed to push his opponent out, or the loser that had all body parts intact but still lost.

inflicting heavy casualties as you've all been bragging is not victory until you subdue or make your enemy surrender.

US killed a lot of Vietnamese but lost the war and fled. do you hear them brag about it.

2smooth2shout:

so who goes home with the trophy and is regarded a winner? the victor with the broken leg that managed to push his opponent out, or the loser that had all body parts intact but still lost.

inflicting heavy casualties as you've all been bragging is not victory until you subdue or make your enemy surrender.

US killed a lot of Vietnamese but lost the war and fled. do you hear them brag about it.

Save us the trouble and go look up "objective". Like, really now.

Which war was lost in CAR? Declared by whom exactly? Against whom?

There was no war.

That was an attack, which we repelled.

For someone who claims to be smooth, your thought process seems to be worryingly glitchy.

Desperation much?

andrewza:

Funny I know people that were there. They don't seem to recale botswan or zim rescuing any body. Or doing any thing of note at all. SA moved and ended the coup.

dude you were supported by Botswana. i already gave proof and i know you SAns to always argue with truth cos you are liars.
SANDF would have lost if not for support from SADC troops. and your troops alone would never be able to handle the conflict. i gave proof of that already. you read it right?

CraigB:

Looking at your write-up, one would expect that you'd rank South Africa further down.

But you don't even have the confidence to do that. .

Budget cuts but still better funded than Naai-geria. Budgets cuts but capable of getting more funding any time war breaks out.

Still more formidable than Naai-geria.

Still ranked higher than Naai-geria, unless you're on Naai-raland. You'll wake up tomorrow and your rankings will have evaporated into the darkness. It's all wishful thinking

I don't think that this fools are serious with all their silly rankings, this thread is probably the only place on the whole web where I've seen Nigeria being ranked above SA in their military, even economy ( according to the monkey agaugust ).. lmaoo. Even the first few pages of these thread and other threads here on nairaland rank us above that country.

SOUTH AFRICA IS BETTER THAN nigeria, ALWAYS HAS, ALWAYS WILL BE.
I suggest that all this losers say that line 100 times a day, so it could sink into their thick skulls.
HA HA HA HA HA HA

We will probably never know whether it is true that SANDF killed more than 20 rebels cos there's no independent source that confirmed 800 rebel casualties, but this explanation for the SANDF defeat sounds just like that explanation a guy once gave his mates after he was beaten-up by a girl… “You should have seen those guys; all ten of them were armed to the teeth. I fought like a tiger!”

seleka defeated SANDF, occupied and ransacked their base. you lost to a group of bandits, lost when you went gallivanting alone in Lesotho, fought a 30 year war and lost. SANDF don't have a professional army and have never won any battle. period

SANDF secured and ransacked by bandits after they fled. and the true scores

2smooth2shout: We will probably never know whether it is true that SANDF killed more than 20 rebels cos there's no independent source that confirmed 800 rebel casualties, but this explanation for the SANDF defeat sounds just like that explanation a guy once gave his mates after he was beaten-up by a girl… “You should have seen those guys; all ten of them were armed to the teeth. I fought like a tiger!”

seleka defeated SANDF, occupied and ransacked their base. you lost to a group of bandits, lost when you went gallivanting alone in Lesotho, fought a 30 year war and lost. SANDF don't have a professional army and have never won any battle. period

You should be ashamed of yourself. You are a joke!

Your comment has been directly plagiarised from the comments section of the racist website below. (As if you're mentally capable of coming up with a statement that creative).

You are a joke and a time waster. What is it with Naai-gerians and the "posing"?

http://www.whitenationnetwork.com/paper/archives/10135

CraigB:

You should be ashamed of yourself. You are a joke!

Your comment has been directly plagiarised from the comments section of the racist website below.

You are a joke and a time waster. What is it with Naai-gerians and the "posing"?

http://www.whitenationnetwork.com/paper/archives/10135

Bunch of crooks these nigerians, that HENDRY01 fella is the only decent Nigerian on this thread.

zetdee:

Bunch of crooks these nigerian.

Creativity requires intelligence.

They don't have it.

So, they'd rather misrepresent things.

SANDF from the perspective of a former member:

I am thinking about what the perception is of the SANDF internationally? If there even is anybody that cares... but for interest sake. I served myself from 1995-1996 in the SANDF but had exposure to it in its old form as the SADF. I got out mostly due to the changes that are now vaunted as making it a "representational force" i. e. lowering of standards, ranks handed out like sweets, ancient and truely obsolete equipment, low pay etc. etc. Nowadays as far as I can discern it is even worse - AIDS ridden troops, private soldiers who have an average age of 30+, and the highest ration of officers to privates in the world. IMHO the old SADF was feared throughout the continent, but the SANDF is not even a shell of what the SADF was. Comments?

and the response from the same real honest south africans

Kanadees
i can only agree with you, what more is their to say?

crazyhorse
Well! When 16 so called black soldiers, fire 2800 rounds of ammunition at a target only 3 metre's away, with only one bullet hitting the target, what can be expected? No wonder the terrorists had to be handed the south africa on a plate by that white terrorist de klerk....without him, they would still be trying to piss the police force off in soweto.

Vryheid
You´re right Rylan, things have gone downhill for ZA´s defense since 1994 and it´s my opinion that a lot of it has to do with integrating the ANC terrorists into national defense. From being the last bulwark against communism in Africa, the SADF has become a joke. Afrikaners can´t join the force because of ¨positive discrimination¨ and they made up the backbone of the old SADF.

zetdee:

Bunch of crooks these nigerians, that HENDRY01 fella is the only decent Nigerian on this thread.

is this the first post that i pasted the critical part of an article from? my source is different from his and i just didn't paste the source. you are a bozo if you deny that post didn't hit you.

agaugust:

south africa has no big military achievment in africa.

Burundi was a piece of cake because the warring sides did not attack south african army like Seleka did. they agreed to ceasfire easily. try that with charles taylor or jonas savimbi.

DRC has no peace yet. Sudan nigerian army was first to land in the north war in Dafur and we stopped the R.ape and G.enocide againt black sudanese by half-arabs sudanese. Nigerian soldiers were attacked at night, some died but we did not run away like south africa in CAR.

South sudan independence from North sudan was AU peace committee of several nations including Nigeria, south africa only has committee chairmanship vested in Thabo Mbeki.

dont steal other nations glosry and give to your 'desperate for recognition' south africa. sharaaap !

.

he did not even know that Abdusalam Abubakar was part of that comittee

2smooth2shout: SANDF from the perspective of a former member:

I am thinking about what the perception is of the SANDF internationally? If there even is anybody that cares... but for interest sake. I served myself from 1995-1996 in the SANDF but had exposure to it in its old form as the SADF. I got out mostly due to the changes that are now vaunted as making it a "representational force" i. e. lowering of standards, ranks handed out like sweets, ancient and truely obsolete equipment, low pay etc. etc. Nowadays as far as I can discern it is even worse - AIDS ridden troops, private soldiers who have an average age of 30+, and the highest ration of officers to privates in the world. IMHO the old SADF was feared throughout the continent, but the SANDF is not even a shell of what the SADF was. Comments?

and the response from the same real honest south africans

Kanadees
i can only agree with you, what more is their to say?

crazyhorse
Well! When 16 so called black soldiers, fire 2800 rounds of ammunition at a target only 3 metre's away, with only one bullet hitting the target, what can be expected? No wonder the terrorists had to be handed the south africa on a plate by that white terrorist de klerk....without him, they would still be trying to piss the police force off in soweto.

Vryheid
You´re right Rylan, things have gone downhill for ZA´s defense since 1994 and it´s my opinion that a lot of it has to do with integrating the ANC terrorists into national defense. From being the last bulwark against communism in Africa, the SADF has become a joke. Afrikaners can´t join the force because of ¨positive discrimination¨ and they made up the backbone of the old SADF.

Wow, dude.

Very credible, given that these are apartheid soldiers that got out just after 94.

You seem to love the opinions of racists, eh? Checked out the rest of the forum?

Yip! You're very smart and your analysis skills are untouchable. SMH.

http://www.strategypage.com/militaryforums/63-65-page2.aspx#startofcomments

2smooth2shout:

is this the first post that i pasted the critical part of an article from? my source is different from his and i just didn't paste the source. you are a bozo if you deny that post didn't hit you.

Let us see your "different" source then, Mr-I-will-call-people-Bozos-like-CraigB.

Plagiarism runs in your veins!

Fact remains: you stole the statement from the source and presented it as your own.

You could never be that creative. Not in your wildest dreams.

zetdee:
that HENDRY01 fella is the only decent Nigerian on this thread.

Exactly. you don't like being challenged so you'll like Henry that doesn't have your time. bozo

if you knew Henry's contribution to military blogs, you'll know you are not the type for him to waste his time for.

2smooth2shout:

Exactly. you don't like being challenged so you'll like Henry that doesn't have your time. bozo

if you knew Henry's contribution to military blogs, you'll know you are not the type for him to waste his time for.

The bolded part says a lot about you then, seeing as you're "wasting time" for @Zetdee.

May we have your "different" source pasted here, please.

You haven't lost it, have you?

Sigh*

Predictably, Mr Smooth runs off.

Run, monkey, run

2smooth2shout:

is this the first post that i pasted the critical part of an article from? my source is different from his and i just didn't paste the source. you are a bozo if you deny that post didn't hit you.

HA HA HA, I see you're trying to hit back, now that you've been beaten to the pulp. As previously stated, there's nothing negative about SA that you can post that i do not know about, I spend alot of time in the blogs and forums where you probably source your info.

There seems to be a mix up about SA military. SADF is totally different from SANDF. The doctrines changed after apartheid regime gave blacks independence. With a lot of the old and ex SADF working as mercineries for private firms worldwide, there are only very few old SADF soldiers that integrated with the new.

So basically, SANDF came to existence in the late 90s. (please dispute my assertion constructively)

Now my question still remains what are the achievements of SANDF?
Read very well before the brainless south africans start to spill senselessness at my question.

2smooth2shout: There seems to be a mix up about SA military. SADF is totally different from SANDF. The doctrines changed after apartheid regime gave blacks independence. With a lot of the old and ex SADF working as mercineries for private firms worldwide, there are only very few old SADF soldiers that integrated with the new.

So basically, SANDF came to existence in the late 90s. (please dispute my assertion constructively)

Now my question still remains what are the achievements of SANDF?
Read very well before the brainless south africans start to spill senselessness at my question.

In which case then, the "Angola defeat" that you were foaming in the mouth about no longer counts?

So, if this is your argument, why did you waste out time all day, talking about Angola?

You're desperate and you seek to punish us for your own confusion, non?

You're not very smart, are you, Smooth?

zetdee:

HA HA HA, I see you're trying to hit back, now that you've been beaten to the pulp.

by who and what to be precise? All you've managed to do is dodge my questions and credible info about your military intervention failures. So far nothing smart has come from all of you in defense except from andrewza.

It shouldn't be a surprise if i decide to go to sleep than waste my time bickering with brainless south africans.

Scratches head*

When were blacks "given independence" now?

Naai-gerian schools are useless.

2smooth2shout:

by who and what to be precise? All you've managed to do is dodge my questions and credible info about your military intervention failures. So far nothing smart has come from all of you in defense except from andrewza.

It shouldn't be a surprise if i decide to go to sleep than waste my time bickering with brainless south africans.

What you have dodged is a simple request for you to post your source, which is apparently "different" to mine.

You lied, loser. There's no such source and therefore, you cannot demand any answers from Zetdee.

Add this onto your growing list of queries, will you?

When were blacks "given independence"?

While you're at that:

Why did you waste our time talking about Angola, given your latest question above?