@me,myself

If most muslims were like you the world would be a better place to live in.

I have not attacked anybodys person because i know we can disagree and still be civil.

You have demonstrated maturity by sticking to the point rather than the person.

Please read the other threads on islam and see how "logical", "Ajisafe" and other muslims on this forum have attacked my person and my parents intstead of the issue. Even if they attack Jesus it is their opinion and I will respect that.

In all this you will not find any of my posts attacking anybody personally even though they have had a field day doing that to me. Dont be quick to commend "logical" please read his previous responses to me on other threads.

Once again the beauty of this world lies in celebrating our diferrences and not warring over them. The only way to change is love and never violence. Excepting you, all the muslims that have responded to me have bee vile, insulting and outrageous in their comments. You can tell they will be quick to thrust a knife through me if we were face to face.


I am really suprised by your response and for once see a light at the end of the tunnel. Please preach your approach more amongst your brothers and sisters and the world will be a better place.

Peace

PS

"Violence begats Violence"

@mrlawng

I have never attacked you? Maybe when i use a word you need to check the dictionary to check the meaning before deducing that it is an insult.

I would really be greatful if you list down what exactly I said, that implied I was attacking your personality. Thank you.

@logical

I would really appreciate it if you would just ignore me on this thread. I really hold no ill will against you.

You have been doing fine since you replied noted.

Peace.

Then why the mention?

mrlawng:

@me,myself

Please read the other threads on islam and see how[b] "logical"[/b], "Ajisafe" and other muslims on this forum have attacked my person and my parents intstead of the issue. Even if they attack Jesus it is their opinion and I will respect that.

Mrlawng, Logical, Syrup,

I have read all the fireworks, and I understand everybody's feelings as they write. But I must make certain things clear. Firstly, Islam is percieved as a terrorist religion today only because of one thing- The Muslims have been negligent. The Muslims allowed the exact things that the Prophet of Islam (SAW) asked them to be mindful of to destroy them. Tribalism and negligence of seeking knowledge. I say this because today, it is the 'Superpower"of the world that defines what a terrorist is. BY American definition, a terrorist is anybody who's against America's interest. It doesn't matter whether this interest is actually moral, based on the major religions of the world, so long as it is in America's interest, anybody against it is a terrorist. Let us examine the facts.

When the US and the Soviet where locked in a battle for supremacy, anybody that demostrated against the status quo in the American establishment was called a communist. Thus, the black uprising in the sixties to protest the way blacks were forced to enrol in the army and fight in Vietnam, was called a communist plot to bring down the president. Thus, the CIA justified it's use of hard drugs to suppress the uprising consequently destroying a generation of African Americans, on the basis of them being communist. When America carried out the bay of pigs invasion of Cuba, it was to challenge communism. When America sponsored the assasination of Chilean president, it was all to help it fight communism. When they carried out a vicious campaign of assasinating nationalist African Heads of State who challenged their hegemonist and dominating tendencies, like Nkurumah, Lumumba, Muritala Mohammed, it was all in a bid to save the world from evil communism. Why am I giving these anecdotes? You will see the connection soon.

Now, when Britain settled Israel in the middle east in the 1940's (then it was the powerhouse of the world), it realised that it couldn't return the Jews to Palestine where they inhabited a long time ago, without a war. What did it do? It drew up something called the Balfour declaration, which states that Palestine will be divided into two states, one called Israel, and the other for the Muslim Arabs living there. Now, after WW2 America became one of the big powers behind the formation of the UN. The UN took over the Israel negotiations and actually sanctioned the creation of two states. But at that time, some Arabs had been ejected forcefully from where they had come to know as home for centuries. Specifically 105 villages including Yasser deir were wiped off the map militarily so that Israel can be born, or is it reborn. Now, the massacres that happened there stoked the anger in the rest of the Arab world, and they started planning to go to war. However, Israel in a pre-emptive attack (whatever that is) destroyed their armies, captured more territory, and killed (which is most objectionable) innocent women, children and old people, just because they were Arabs. This coming in the heels of a similar persecution of the Israeli in the hands of the Nazis, was a real surprise to the world. Thus, a cycle of hate was born. Now with the collapse of the Soviets (it didn't matter to the US that the soviets were also christians), US became the sole world Power. It's economy had expanded, and it became ever so greedy for oil, a resource in abundance in the middle east. The Arabs (who brought Islam to the world) were angry and at war with Israel. They also saw US as an enemy because of it's assistance to Israel in the past. So two things became the foreign policy of the US. 1. Get the UN to recognize Israel as a state, consequently, it will be able to buy arms, develop them, cooperate militarily with other countries. 2. Prevent Palestine from becoming a state. So it will be illegal for any countries to sell arms to them, or receive military cooperation. Now, the US used a carrot and stick approach in the Middle-east. Either you comply, give US your oil and have it support your rule, or get toppled by whatever means necessary and be brandished a negative element-since communism was no longer in vogue, they had to invent or better put apply a new word-Terrorism. But the toga of terrorism was not yet widely accepted at that moment. Now the Arabs frustrated that inspite of a UN resolution agreeing to give Palestinians a State, not much was done in this direction by a largely docile international community, and seeing reprehensible acts of suppression and genocide being meted to the Palestinians who had AK's against armoured tanks, M16 Gunships, apache helicopter gunships, F22 Bombers, thought of a new way of fighting. Since they couldn't fight the armoured tanks face to face, in desperation, started a new offensive-suicide bombing, targetting not just military, but also the civilian populace of Israel. This new form of attack was unprecendeted. The Israeli and Americans, with the whole world were astounded. They couldn't believe that people will blow themselves up for a cause- which is to get back their land. Violence by the state of Israel only excerbated the situation as these Arabs saw themselves fighting a just cause in Islam, which is preventing others from oppressing them. Now the strategy of violence worked well to serve the USs interest in taking oil from the Arabs as states that do not comply will have their regimes toppled sublty or openly. Also after the signing of the Nuclear non-proliferation treaty, Israel still acquired nuclear technology from the US and this made the Arabs to be insecure and feel unjustly treated. Thus, the never ending cycle of antagonism started. Muslims all over the world saw this happenings as an affront to them, their religion and way of life. But this alone did not cause the worlwide Muslim reaction it's causing now. It was a combination of factors that led to the paranoia with which Muslims world over view Western interests and ideas. The media helped demonise Muslims, and this led to their feeling under siege. Now, somebody feeling like he is under siege is bound to be paranoid, and consequently aggressive. Time and time again, rules will be set, Israel will violate these rules, and scoff at the international community with US behind their back, as if saying what do you want to do about it. This led to a loss of faith in the current order of things by Muslims. Thus, we had loose Clerics employing demagoguery, asking gullible young Muslims to employ suicide attacks as a strategy to combat the all-powerful oppressive power called the western power. So, even in states where these strategy was needless, it was used. This continued the cycle of hate, making Christians and other religions feel threatened and justifiably so. Now this oppression became like a double edged sword, as it was also used by Muslim clerics who were compromised, to ignite hatred for christians among Muslim youths. Consequently, if political leaders needed to show their relevance to the authorities in countries like Nigeria, all they needed to do was pay a cleric who will preach on friday about the oppression of muslims world over, especially in the middle-east. He will turn fear into anger and anger into hatred. He will then order that all Christians in their vicinity must be punished for this acts of oppression against
Muslims. They must be killed, so that the youths will enter heaven if they die in those conflicts. And a largely uneducated followership( uneducated in Islamic teachings) carries out the teachings to the letter killing innocent Christians. This in turn further drums-up support for their (christians) earlier stereotypes that muslims are terrorist, a view preached all too often by the western dominated media. The Americans, seen to be a Christian state, but not really so (otherwise, if it were so Christian, why would it allow gay marriages, gay priests, the church of Satan-things that challenge the christian faith directly exist and protected) will then play up these images of hatred, magnify them and blow them out of proportion to create a sense of fear in it's citizens in order to draw support for even harder tactics against Muslims. The hate cyle is then complete.

Now after all this story, let me take you back to where I started from. Muslims are terrorists today because Ameriaca Says so and it is the new toga in getting whatever it wants (in this case oil from the Arab states)- A classical case of calling a dog a bad name in order to hang it. Why does everyone believe America? It is the world power. The moment Muslims allowed the Ottoman empire to break up, they gave the upperhand to people who are interested not in salvation of their people or any other people, but in dominating others for their own survival. Otherwise, how would you explain the slavery Africa and Asia were subjected to, inspite of the christian religion being the religion of the colonialists. If today, everybody in the world became a christian or jew, there still will be the ongoing war because at the end, it's about control of resources, not necessarily religion. The only way Muslims will stop being terrorists is if they became the world power again. But religion, ideology, ethnicity serve the purposes of being the vehicle through whichacts of hate are justified. Now some Christians know this, but why are they willing collaborators?

There are two reasons;
1. What they experience first hand in the hands of rampaging Jihadists killing people senselessly, Jihadists who play to the script written for them by faceless people with personal interests. By reacting impulsively, instead of allowing deep thought and reflection influence their actions these Jihadists or more appropriately killers perpetuate hate.
2.They (Christians) are distracted by their individual concerns for glory, glamour, security, prosperity, group membership and standing, along with the usual petty vices related to sloth, gluttony and sex ( the vices do not apply to real christians). They don’t want to risk unpopularity and reduced career prospects by countering mainstream thinking, however manipulated this may have been. Delusion can be comforting and appear desirable, so even when they recognise the truth, that some Muslims are facing oppression, they are afraid to say it or challenge it.

"However, I conclude with the thought that truth, and reflection on the most important and relevant kinds of truths, are what’s most needed for peace in the world today". I think it is necessary at this point to bring a quote by Professor Randal Marlin, Adjunct Professor iat Carleton University Ottawa, Canada.

"But we cannot afford to acquiesce in the simplistic imagery that is thrown at us from our political leadership, advertisers and mass media. This is too often skewed toward special and not public interests. Meditative thinking, looking for and supporting those forces that counter-act such things as reckless acquisitiveness, unchecked fears, hatreds and prejudices -- that’s the way to peace ahead. There are many sources in the Internet that give support for meditative thinking and the factual basis for resisting simplistic imagery. But it’s up to the individual to make use of those sources".
Muslims and Christians, this is what we need.

While you continue to bother yourselves about what essentially should be a Christian's problem, maybe you should focus those parochial racial thoughts to Islam?
Why does Islam require you all to visit Mecca at least once in your life time? Why must you face mecca? Why must the Arabic way of life have to be imposed on all peoples who you have as adherents? Why is the Quaran written in Arabic? Why are you all asked to learn Arabic?
The racial superiority complex to me comes somewhere from the sands of Arabia. Let's take it home to Naija. Hausa and Fulani Muslim's who are more closely related to the Arabs look on the southern and western Naija moslems as less Islamic.
'Remove the log in your eyes before you can see clearly to remove the speck in others.'
TayoD, please note every single word I use:
1. When we pray, we face Mecca because the holy mosque, which Prophet Muhammad himself met in this world is located over there. The site is believed to have been sent down By Allah (SWT) since the time of Adam.
2. The Arabic way of life is not imposed on the adherents of Islam: It is the Islamic way of life that is imposed on us, as even many of the Arabic ways were rejected on the advent of Islam. Islam teaches us to embrace every practice that is good, be it Arabic, English, or even African. If the Arabic way of life is imposed on us, then perhaps, every Muslim should be putting on a turban, eating with their bare hands just to mention a few.
3. The Qur-an was revealed in Arabic, and is therefore written in Arabic to preserve its originality. As you know, there is absolutely no way you can successfully translate one language to another, without making little mistakes. I'm sorry to say this: I had a copy of the Bible, and when Reading through it, I realized very silly mistakes in it that shouldn't have been there, which mean during the process of translation, it had undergone alterations, additions and subtractions, only if the Bibles of these days did not come from a pure source. If only it was in its original texts, researchers could have been able to clarify those alterations.
4. Now, lets analyze why we are asked to learn Arabic. Now that you have seen why the Qur-an is in Arabic, would you now rather be reading what you do not understand? Then how will you be sure that what you're reading is sincere? That's why we are challenged to learn Arabic. So that if we notice any thing that is incorrect, we will be able to conclude that this is not the right way, rather than blindly following what you do not know, and by Allah's grace, nobody that has learned Arabic and studied the real text of the Qur-an has been able to challenge its supremacy over other books.
5. We are meant to go to Mecca at least ones in a life time, so that the feelings of brotherhood is restrengthened among us all. There are also some spiritual reasons such as Familiarizing with with the holy house, believed to have been sent down by Allah (SWT) and so on.

Lastly, the Qur-an says to us that your colour, race, height or the amount of wealth accumulated by you does not matter. What matters is your piety(faith). Unlike the Christians that have already subjected themselves to the Israelites, believing that they are the Superior and preferred race. Ponder about all these TayoD and ask more questions when you are ready. Thanks.

Dear Mr. OlaAjia and TayoD,

I read with interest the posers by TayoD, and the response by Mr. OlaAjia, and while I must commend OlaAjia's efforts to clarify issue, there are still some outstanding posers, and that's what I'll try to expouse on.

Muslims face Mecca world over because that is where the Ka'aba is. Now, the Ka'aba is believed to be the first shrine for the worship of God by Muslims. When man went astray by associating partners with God, he abandoned it and it was consequently left derelict. However, Abraham(ASW) on one of his journeys to visit Hajar and her son Ishmael, was commanded by God to rebuild it. And so Father and son rebuilt the Ká'aba while circumambulating it. That is why today, Muslims all over the world face it. Now, as one of the scientific wonders of the world, The positioning of the Ka'aba is such that it is centrally placed and anywhere you are on the surface of the earth, if you face east, then you are facing the Ka'aba. That is why some people erroneously think that Muslims face the sun. No. The sun rises from the east, and Muslims are asked to face just left of the exact direction the sun rises from. So when next you see Muslims face the direction where the sun rises from, you'll know that they face the Ka'aba which they believe to be the first place of worship of God.

As regards why we have to visit mecca, even as a christian, I know you appreciate the essence of brotherhood in your faith. The injunction on visiting Mecca at least once in your lifetime for those who can afford it, is therefore in furtherance of this objective. Let me tell you a short story. As at the 1940s and 50s when blacks were still being discriminated against by the whites( I am not saying it has stopped just yet), Malcom X who was a Muslim in reaction to this discrimination went to Mecca. But before he embarked on that trip, he belong to a Muslim organisation called Black Nation of Islam whose singular objective was to fight the whites and the christianity which they professed but hardly believed in. But when Malcom reached Mecca, and he saw black, white, red, arab, indian, all of them bowed down in prostration to the Almighty creator, he re-examined his Muslim faith and changed his ideology. He paid dearly for it with his life though, but it was worth the while. The lesson here is that he saw Islam unite the hearts of all these people in submission to their creator, and class, strata based on race, colour etc, were broken. The only separation was based on the piety of the worshippers, and this was known to God alone. He discovered this by undergoing a pilgrimage to Mecca. Besides this, anybody that has been to Mecca with the right intentions, comes back to say how refreshing it was as a spiritual experience. I hope you are clear on this now.

I suspect you must know that the bible initially was written in Hebrew, which was the language Jesus(ASW) spoke. It was however translated to greek, latin, and then the anglosaxons of which English is a part. Now, in Islam we have learnt lessons from the translation of the bible wholly, and how this has caused loss of meaning in some verses, and ambiguity in others. That is why the Quran retains it's original Arabic form. However, we have it's interpretations in other languages, but these are just what they are-interpretations and translations. They cannot substitute the original Arabic Quran as it is. Consequently all Muslims are enjoined to learn Arabic to get a proper understanding of the message.

In Naija, unfortunately some Hausas and Fulani have a complex as you rightly said. I experienced this first hand during my Youth Service. And I must say, there are a lot of them who do not have a complex too. But those who exhibit any form of complex, simply betray a manifestation of their level of ignorance in Islamic teachings. In Islam, discrimination or superiority complex is strictly forbidden. And I can tell you that a re-awakening is taking place in Northern Nigeria as we speak. Same also for southern Nigeria where some Muslims practice less-than-Islamic behaviour which clerics from the North harp -on to make their conclusions about southern Muslims. I used to be a state official of Muslim Corpers Association of Nigeria(MCAN) in one of the Northern States, and I will tell you that some members of the Northern intelligetsia are addressing this problem already. The Dan Masanin Kano specifically chided some Hausas for this attitude at one of MCAN's conferences in Abuja. Now don't you worry, it is a problem in Naija now, we have identified it, and we are doing things about it. But I dare advise you to help your Christian brothers and sisters amongst the caucasians, and mongoloids who still have a problem with recognising other races as creatures of God who deserve respect and human treatment. A true Muslim would dare not habour such thoughts talkless of acting on it.

Once again, I will congratulate Mr. OlaAjia for a job well done. TayoD, even if you do not accept these reasons, at least you know now why somethings are like they are in Islam. Keep up the inquisition, and the truth shall set you free.

wow! i would say i was very enlightened here.thanks ajia23 and olaajia, u guyz related?

@ Ajisafe

I saw some of the things you wrote about the Christians, and other Muslims and thought we could meet on MSN so we could discuss them. But it seems you turned down the invitation. Firstly, I tried to assess you, and I have come to one conclusion. You learnt Islam and became fixated on one ideology-An eye for an eye. Let me give you examples of how the Prophet (SAW) dealt with insults. On two different occasions, he was insulted, what did he do? He replied with a better word. Do you find that hard to do? Even if the Christians started the desecration of our religious Icons, the prophet (SAW) specifically said we were not to retialate so that they do not go further and cause more damage which is what has happened so far. Please in the future be more suave, it doesn't necessarily mean that you are a coward. Besides, much of Islamic world was won by diplomacy and not conflict. Yes, there times when it's necessary to sting, but like I asserted earlier, it must be measured.

Now, because of your wild assertions, you actually called another Muslim a hypocrite. You went well out of your league to do that because the prophet (SAW) warned that when you call someone a hypocrite, and that person isn't, then you have become one yourself. Even during the time of the prophet (SAW) the hypocrites that were revealed were not attacked verbally by the believers. So I think you need to apologise to me, myself. Also, you condemned a whole country, and hurt their feelings by disparaging them in that manner. These definitely are not what a good muslim should do. I am Nigerian, but I will tell you something about Kenyan Muslims, they are more sincere than Nigerians. You need to get out of Nigeria to experience other lands. For instance 50% of the Muslim population here is Arab. And they have proper Aqidah. I know because I schooled in Oyo state, and my school was brandished an aqeedah school by the rest of the MSS. I also think the Kenyans deserve an apology. I would also like to see you apologise to the Christians you abused. Even if they riled our Prophet (SAW), they did not deserve those invectives you cast at them. I believe their teachings will also make them apologise to you evetually. But you are Muslim, and you should be an example.

Finally, I would want this platform to be used for constructive dialogue geared to make us all get a better understanding of each other, rather than a means to engage ourselves in diatribes of the manner I have seen.

Peace be unto you believers in the One true God.

God! I'm tired of fighting these so-called Muslims. Please, I'm only here to put the kufars aright. Use your energy on them -- not me.

My dear Ajisafe,
Humility is a virtue well espoused in the Islamic faith. I just hope you will stop for once and sincerely regret if you made mistakes, and if possible retrace your steps. While I agree that I should correct stereotypes held against Muslims by Non-muslims, nevertheless, I should be able to help my brother recognise when he has committed faux pas, and indeed redeem him. This is the essence of brotherhood in Islam.

It's not too late to say I am sorry for being so aggresive, I got real mad at what they said about my beliefs. If you do that, then your standing with God increases one level. Remember- Laisa Shadid Mon Garaba Nafsi, Ina Ma ál Shadid mon garab Nafsahu in dal Ghadab. He is not strong who can beat his opponent, but he is strong who can control himself when he is angry.

So I will continue to try persuading non-muslims not to do some of what they do which is by the way very offensive to my religion, but at the same time, I will remind my brothers to be mindful of their approach. May Allah help us.

Dear Ajisafe,
I dont know what to say, but you have gone beyound the horizons of what is expected from a true believer. I encourage that you listen to ajia23 and apologise as expected. Just a piece of advise . thank you.

You just don't worry yourself -- I'm fine. My spiritual inclination is toward Allah only. Be very, very careful. And -- you know what  -- just like the other munafikins had done in the past, you'll only gladen the kufars' perverted hearts by exchanging heated words with me. Who's been arrogant? Is it you that got angry because I didn't honor your sick -Kenyan invitation? Be very careful, boy! You should be ashamed of yourself for even trying to confront me. Don't you know who I am? Psyche! Of all places, you were flaunting your wretched living in Kenya. Shame on you.

@ Logical, please!

Thank you logical for cautioning him.

when I read his other reply, I suspected he may not really be Muslim afterall. I am not saying he is not, but it beats my wildest imagination that a Muslim will be this aggressive, and would even refuse to take advice especially from his muslim brothers. It makes me wonder, but I guess I'll just ignore him until he makes a volte-face. If by calling Kenya a wretched place he thought to hurt me, he failed miserably because I am Nigerian. But most importantly, I am Muslim and such cheap blows will not make me lose my cool.

I only just wonder how he knows somethings about Islam, because the temptation would be to imagine the hand of a non-muslim behind this character. Well, God knows.

hmm, anyway I hope you digest the following. I wont futher indulge myself.

“The believing men and women are each other’s protectors; they enjoin what is right and forbid what is wrong.” While, “the hypocrite men and women are each other’s protectors, they enjoin what is wrong and forbid what is right.” (9:71)

@ Logical
I do understand that, and that's why I tried to caution him. I actually invited him to MSN so we could make it discreet, but he declined. Well, I would not continue to correct him anymore, I have done my bit of enjoining what is good and forbidding what is evil. I hope the rest of you will do the same for me.
Ma Salam

Does anybody in Nigeria want to live under Sharia laws? Do you want your sisters and daughters to be subjected to the cruel laws of Islam where if they are raped, unless they have four male Muslim witnesses attesting to the act of the perpetrator, the women themselves are assumed to be guilty of unlawful sexual activity and are then convicted and sentenced to being stoned to death? This usually involves digging a hole and putting the woman into it up to her waist so she cannot easily escape, and then pelting her with stones until she is dead.


The poor women are punished three times! First, the original rape. Second, the second class treatment in the justice system. Third, their being stoned to death.

If you live in a non-Islamic state and have never seen a stoning, you might want to view what the Islamic justice system can produce:

http://www.apostatesofislam.com/media/stoning.htm

The real face of Islam in Nigeria

2001-SEP: Nigeria: A teenage single mother, Bariya Ibrahim Magazu claimed at trial that she was raped by three men. The court assumed that she was guilty, because she could not prove that her father pressured her to engage in sexual activity with the men. She was found guilty of two offenses: having pre-marital sex, and bringing false charges against the men that she claimed were responsible. Her sentence was 180 lashes. 5 "When nongovernmental groups ramped up pressure to free the girl, the government immediately carried out the sentence, ignoring a promised appeal process. The local authorities said they wanted to put an end to the controversy."

[b]2001-OCT: [/b]Nigeria: Safiya Hussaini Tungar-Tudu, a 30-year-old pregnant woman, had asked a Sharia court in Sokoto state to force a man that she alleged had raped her, to pay for her daughter's naming ceremony. The court refused, and then charged her with engaging in sexual intercourse outside of marriage. She was sentenced to be stoned to death. The man that she allegedly had sex with was freed by the court for lack of evidence. She successfully appealed the conviction. An appeal judge overturned her conviction, stating that there were very serious errors in her arrest and trial. She had not been given any legal representation, and the court had failed to establish the basic facts of the case. Above all, the alleged act of adultery had taken place before the Sharia law was implemented in the state. She was freed, and planned to remarry her former husband.

According to an Australian newspaper, the governor of Sokoto, Attahiru Bafarawa, "attacked the European Union and women's rights groups for criticising the Islamic court that sentenced her. He said he had received more than 500 letters from interest groups and individuals protesting against the conviction." Bafarawa said: "Unfortunately, most of the human rights groups were not patient enough to allow justice to take its course in the case of Safiya. Instead, they chose to be putting pressure on the executive arm of the government to interfere with the course of justice."

2001-DEC: Sudan: An 18 year-old pregnant woman, Abok Alfa Akok, was accused by her husband of adultery. She claimed that she had been raped. The man co-accused with Abok was not tried due to lack of evidence. She was tried, even though the country claims that Sharia would not be applied to non-Muslims. In Sudan, a married person found guilty of adultery is executed by stoning; an unmarried person receives 100 lashes. She had no lawyer, and was unaware of her rights during the trial. She could not speak or understand Arabic, the language of the court. The Court of Appeal in Southern Darfur overturned the death sentence and sent the case back to the lawyer court which set punishment at 75 lashes. By immediately executing the sentence, she was denied her right to obtain legal advice and/or an launch an appeal prior to the beating.

2002-MAR: Nigeria: Safiya Hussaini, 33, was convicted of adultery. She was sentenced to be buried up to her neck in sand and to be stoned to death. However, her sentence was deferred until her 13-month-old daughter has finished nursing. She appealed her conviction. Her cousin, a Mr. Abubakar allegedly confessed to police that he had sex with her three times. However, the judge dismissed the testimony of the three policemen who witnessed Abubakar's confession, because a minimum of four witnesses are required under Sharia law. Hussaini's lawyers claimed that she also could not be convicted because of the four witness rule. The prosecution argued that witnesses were not required in her case; adultery had obviously taken place because she had become pregnant. Her defense team finally argued that, under Islamic law, the interval between conception and birth can be up to seven years! Only two years previous to the birth of her daughter, she was still married to her husband. The lawyers argued that her husband could possibly have been the father. Commenting on the conviction, Aliyu Abubakar Sanyinna, the attorney general of Sokoto State, said: "Society is injured by her act. The danger is that it will teach other women to do the same thing." 9 Mansur Ibrahim Said, Dean of the Law Faculty at Dakar University in Sokoto said that adultery is "an abomination abhorred by God and society because of the example it gives and because it creates bastards to be rejected by society."

The appeals court later reversed the lower court conviction. They ruled that the alleged act had taken place before Sharia law was activated in the province, and adultery became a criminal offence. There was strong international interest in her case. The European Union, the parliament of Italy and many non-governmental organizations, appealed for Safiya to be spared. 10 In 2002-JUL, she married an entertainer in her local village.


2002-MAR: Nigeria: A woman, Amina Lawal Kurami, from the small village of Kurami in Katsina in norther Nigeria was sentenced to death for adultery. The sentence was delayed for eight months (one source said 2 years) until she has finished breast feeding her infant. Nigerian Justice Minister, Kanu Agabi, declared this and other Sharia punishments discriminatory and therefore unconstitutional. This is the first time that the national government has made its position clear. 11 She appealed the conviction, on the basis that the offence occurred before Sharia law came into effect. Her lawyers also claimed that she had no legal representation in her original court trial before a village court. The appeal was rejected by the Islamic High Court in Funtua in Katsina state. Dozens of spectators cheered and shouted "God is great". Her execution will be delayed until at least 2004-JAN until her daughter has finished breastfeeding. The federal government is planning to help Kurami appeal her sentence to the Nigerian Supreme Court. This case may ignite a major legal battle between the state and federal governments. 12 Her case was eventually dismissed.

2002-MAY: Nigeria: A man, Sarimu Mohammed, 50, was sentenced to be stoned to death by a court in Jigawa for raping a nine-year-old girl.

2002:Bauchi: A woman, Adama Unusua, 19, was sentenced to 100 lashes by a Bauchi court, for engaging in sexual intercourse with her fiancé. She was pregnant at the time of the trial.

2002-JUN: Nigeria: A Sharai court convicted a man, Yunusa Rafin Chiwaya, of adultery in the northern state of Bauchi, and sentenced him to be stoned to death. He had confessed to engaging in sexual activities with his neighbor's wife, and had declined multiple opportunities to withdraw his confession. The woman in the case was cleared after she swore on the Qur'an that she had been hypnotized before she left home with Chiwaya. 13
bullet 2002-AUG-25: Nigeria: he Upper Sharia court in the northern state of Niger has sentenced two people to be stoned to death. Ahmadu Ibrahim, 32, and his lover Fatima Usman had confessed to pre-marital sex. They have 30 days in which to appeal the sentence.

2002-AUG-30: USA: A group of 25 women from the National Organization of Women (NOW) demonstrated in front of the Nigerian Embassy in Washington DC chanting: "Stoning women is barbaric, Follow the law and not the Cleric." And: "Ho, Ho! Hey, Hey! Religious extremists go home and pray!" They carried signs that stated: "Nigeria, stop stoning women" and "Rocks are for gardens, not to hurt women." NOW overlooked the fact that more men than women have been sentenced to be stoned to death in Nigeria.

2002-SEP-24: Nigeria: By a vote of 4 to 1, a five judge panel overturned Amina Lawal Kurami's conviction. The appeals court found that lower courts had committed many errors under Sharia law:
bullet Muslim belief allows for a five year interval between human conception and birth. Five years prior to the date of her daughter's birth, she was still married to her husband.
bullet She was not given ample opportunity to defend herself. Only one judge was present at her initial conviction; three are required under local Sharia law.

This is not new. Certain munafikins on this forum have wondered ignobly like you in the past. I'm a true Muslim. I have said it before and I'll repeat it: if you are too scared to say the truth (call a spade a spade) by confronting the kufars, please don't put difficulties in my way. If you desist not Allah (SWT) will chastise you all -- just watch. Don't worry about my aggressive stance against the kufar -- worry about your damnable souls, for trying to win the kufars' affection and, in the process, alienate your "Muslim brother." You need to proclaim astaghfrulai 1000 times, so you can be forgiven by Allah. I'm serious.

@Reverend you are still yet to provide the proof in regards to the Qurannic conflicts.

Well have you read any book on shariah before, because if you have taken you time to actually read about shariah the question wouldnt arise.

@ Logical & Ajisafe

Do you both agree with Sharia Law?

@Reverend
Yes.
But the question is , Do you understand Shariah Law? If not I would quickly cover the basics and I am sure you wouldnt mind the law.

@ Reverend,
There's nothing wrong with Sharia Law.

I understand sharia law and I find it barbaric and it is supported by the evil people on this planet!

Anybody that supports Sharia Law is supporting crimes against humanity

Sharia does not allow freedom of speech on such matters as criticism of the prophet Muhammad.

The Qur'an says that Allah curses the one who harms the Prophet in this world and He connected harm of Himself to harm of the Prophet. There is no dispute that anyone who curses Allah is killed and that his curse demands that he be categorized as an unbeliever. The Judgment of the unbeliever is that he is killed. [, ] There is a difference between , harming Allah and His Messenger and harming the believers. Injuring the believers, short of murder, incurs beating and exemplary punishment. The judgement against those who harm Allah and His Prophet is more severe -- the death penalty.

On Sunday, August 15, a 16-year-old girl in the town of Neka, northern Iran, was executed. Ateqeh Sahaleh was hanged in public on Simetry Street off Rah Ahan Street at the city center,

In her summary trial, the teenage victim did not have any lawyer and efforts by her family to recruit a lawyer was to no avail. Ateqeh personally defended herself. She told the religious judge, Haji Rezaii, that he should punish the main perpetrators of moral corruption not the victims.

The judge personally pursued Ateqeh’s death sentence, beyond all normal procedures and finally gained the approval of the Supreme Court. After her execution Rezai said her punishment was not execution but he had her executed for her “sharp tongue”.

This shows that you do not understand Shariah at all. I would write a comprehensive article on it in a new thread, title, Shariah in reality. Watch out.

Reverend you hardly know what you say

A married muslim person guilty of having sex, and who confesses personally, or against whom incontrovertible evidence has been established, is the one that is stoned to death. And for your information, the Jews still practice that law too, it was derived from them, but modifications have since been made in Islam. For instance, you would need four witnesses to catch people doing it in the act, and I dare say this in itself is hardly an achievable feat as these witnesses are required to prove that they did not spy on you. Now, in this day, is it possible for a person to go to another person's house, knock on the door, and be told to come in and still catch them having sex? If you bust into people having sex (that is without asking for permission to enter), and you dare stand up to witness against them, the Share 'ah demands that you be flogged and your evidence discountenanced. Now, if  this is almost impossible for one person, how would it be possible for four? What this means that is the requirement for obtaining evidence and subsequent prosecution is so skewed against the evidence givers, that it will be almost impossible to actually prosecute cases of extramarital or pre-marital infidelity. So in essence, Islam prefers those who commit those sins to repent to their God in private without letting people know what they had done. This is the modification of the one currently practised by the Jews. To illustrate this further, during the lifetime of the Prophet of Islam (SAW), a woman came to hi in self confession that she committed extra-marital sex offences. He (SAW) turned away from her. She came to him again and reaffirmed what she said, to which he replied that she should go and give birth to the baby she was carrying (a whole 9 months period). After this, she approached him again, then he asked her if she had breast fed the baby, she replied no, then he said go and wean the baby. In Islam, this takes two years. After weaning the baby, she comes back the fourth time, then the Prophet (SAW) said she should be stoned. After her sentence was carried out, he told his companons that the woman would enter paradise for her insistence on punishment on earth. And he also encouraged that people in unpleasant situations like that should confess privatelly, instead of making it public knowledge. Now, the essence of this story was to illustrate that the woman was given 2 yrs and nine months to repent and turn over a new leaf, but she chose the path of honour to have the punishment meted to her. And this is under the same Islamic law you wish to debase.

Thanks for that picture anyway, I didn't know that's how the punishment of stoning to death is carried out, you know few executions of the punishment  is carried out today in the world. In the lifetime of the prophet (SAW), very few recordings were made of people who were stoned to death for illicit extramarital affairs.

I just saw this as an ooportunity to throw some light on this topic, otherwise I would not have dignified your poser with a response as it is totally irrelevant to the title of this thread. Islamism- the new global threat. I suggest in the future you start a new thread.

Islam in Action

Stoning to death is a cruel insane Islamic punishment given to people who are married but still voluntarily have sex outside marriage. This punishment was ordered by the "merciful" Prophet, who of course was the messenger of the "merciful" Allah.

I just saw this as an ooportunity to throw some light on this topic, otherwise I would not have dignified your poser with a response as it is totally irrelevant to the title of this thread. Islamism- the new global threat. I suggest in the future you start a new thread.

If you do not think that these barbarians pose a threat to the free World then I feel sorry for you!

Merciful (Mer"ci*ful) (?), a.
[Mercy + -ful.]

1. Full of mercy; having or exercising mercy; disposed to pity and spare offenders; unwilling to punish. "The Lord, the Lord God, merciful and gracious." Ex. xxxiv. 6. "Be merciful, great duke, to men of mold." Shak.
2. Unwilling to give pain; compassionate. "A merciful man will be merciful to his beast." Old Proverb.

Synonyms -- Compassionate; tender; humane; gracious; kind; mild; clement; benignant.

Merciful Allah my ass!

What is the correlation between Stoning to death and Terrorism. Please try to be objective. Also, even the current Judeo-Christian laws we have still supports taking lives, like for instance, in the case of someone who takes another person's life unjustly. And that is why in the US, people who are convicted of murder are either electrocuted or given the lethal injection, same goes for Nigeria where armed robbers are shot at the stake. In the old testament, a life for a life was ordained. Now from the foregoing, are you insinuating that the God that gave those laws is not merciful? Do the christians and Jews worship the same God? When the Jews execute this law, does that mean their God lacks mercy? And are you advocating that there shouldn't be punishment for doing wrong? What law exactly would your worship prefer mankind to follow?

Please answer these posers reverend. Also, I find it indeed curious that a reverend would use such uncomplimentary language as "merciful my a, ",  Keep it going, you are revealing yourself. By their fruits we shall know them.

@ Reverend,
This is hypocritical and you know it. How many people (even innocent ones) are being put to death each year in America? The state of Texas alone (even worse when George Bush was governor) is responsible for most of the murders. Or is it because we don't have those pictures of the actual killings being carried out? Is death penalty terrorism or what? Alas! Even in a self-proclaimed "judeo-christian" nation like America? Please, think well before you attack Islam.

Bravo Ajisafe,Bravo, you put it succintly enough for even a daft to understand.

@ ajia 23,
I was too tired early this morning when I read your invitation to meet on MSN. If you felt slighted a bit, it was never intentional. But, I hope you and other Muslims would understand my duty as a unique Muslim. Allah has put me in this world to be a thorn in the kufars' butts. Remember Umar? What kind of a Muslim he was? Even the Holy Prophet Muhammad had to do a special 'dua (prayer) to Allah before he could win Umar over to the Deen of al-Islam. Why? Because the Prophet needed him (Umar). People like me are needed in Islam to put the kufars in their place. We cannot all be laggards and cowards. That's what the kufars want. They want to pitch us against one another -- it only serves their evil purpose. Do your own as a "gentle brother." But leave me alone to deal with the kufars. I'm ready to meet fire with fire!

The following is culled from my response to certain kufars and Muslim munafikins on another thread. Politics to be exact. Please, go over it and you'll see my argument. Peace.



"First of all, I say, shame on you to all the christian hypocrites on this forum! Why? For more than three months, when it was obvious that many so-called Muslims were too scared to defend al-Islam by confronting the kufars in their silliness, I, Ajisafe, was the only vanguard of my Deen. Initially, I only asked the christians why they were so particular about "miracles" and whether their lying "men of God" who go about siphoning churches' funds were not just decieving them. In lieu of genuine and unequivocal answers to my questions, the likes of evil-intended Layi (an apostate) and Bad guy who calls himself "goodguy" (a non-christian idol worshipper) resorted to their usual name-calling, viz., "terrorist," millitant, and etc. They were quickly joined by other myopic christian fools. I knew then that many "Muslims" were there following the thread, as both my person and my religion were being vilified. They ("Muslims" kept mum until I gave it to the crusaders without mercy. That was when I started reading devilish pieces by those so-called Muslims, attacking me (their supposed brother in Islam) while delighting the crusaders. I was so upset by these their tomfooleries that I left the kufars alone and faced those damnable "Muslims." Apparently, these so-called Muslims were so scared and blinded that they couldn't discern the excesses of the disbelieving folks (kufars). So, I told them to keep their mouths shut. But there was this lunatic from America who called herself a "Muslima" -- she just wouldn't leave me alone. She and I were at it for a very long time -- boy, did we make the kufars so happy! I am a very proud Muslim and I'm ready to defend my Deen at any time-T. Today, all over the world, certain "Muslims," the munafikins (hypocrites), are ready to befriend the kufars at the expense of their fellow Muslim brothers or sisters. They are wary and mindful of the kufars' lenghty and useless diatribe. Lest the kufars tag them (their usual, spent, and outdated cry) "terrorist," they quickly intervene and berate their own "brother" to appease the "crying baby" crusaders. That's the only reason why the cowardly kufars always refer to those "moderate Muslims" in their posts. Look, I'm not at all surprised by this, it's happening right now, in the West, as we speak. Usually Western Media, like CNN, hold "religious roundtable" whence the so-called "Muslim moderates" are pitched against the vehemently bigoted christian firebrands. These so-called "moderates" always irritatingly act silly with no fervor in them to pass across an Islamic point of view. The Western moderators or hosts are ever delighted at their sheer stupidity that they warmly greet and credit them. Those munafikins live for nothing but the pomps of this temporary life. I'm sorry for them. So, when next you hear a kufar say: "I hope all Muslims are like so and so" -- there is no doubt about it, he has noticed his "Mungun," the Islamic fall guy. And those fools are happy that the crusaders have accepted them by calling them "moderates." I, Ajisafe, will always defend the religion of al-Islam, the Qur'an, Holy Prophet Muhammad, and those who are true Muslims. And if any kufar violates any of the aforementioned, he or she will incur my wrath. There's no smoke without fire -- most of the time, I have only reacted to the kufars' silliness. That's all. So, anytime anyone of those doomed crusaders derisively mentions Ajisafe's name, please, know they are nothing but liars! Now, let me answer some fools:-

@twinstaiye

you say september 11. But who drew first blood. All this afghanistan and iraqi saga was all fueled by september 11. I think its very wrong for anyone to use the name of religion to destroy lifes and terrorize people

See. Haven't the disbelieving folks (kufars) repeated severally that George Bush's war on Muslim nations was never a religious one? Look at how stupid this guy sounds!

well said lawng, i couldn't agree less or more.


@Ajisafe and his groupie f*cks: like i once said, keep talking sh*t, it only helps reduce the waste out of your body

This kid is not to be taken seriously; he's just like that retarded Western boy, emmie4j, -- he only seeks unnecessary attention. I have always ignored him. He's a sick little crusader.

If you had taken your time to read the whole of mrlawng's post carefully, you'd see that he was not in anyway attacking the muslims, nor was he making mockery of the quran (religion?). Rather, he was only trying to show the extremity of what a man like Ahmadinejad would do to justify his wicked intentions.

That's not true! Go over that autistic slowpoke's postings -- all of them -- you'll see nothing but insults, heresy, and open blasphemy toward Prophet Muhammad (SAW), the Qur'an, and Allah (SWT). So, you're wrong and biased!

it is so unfortunate that we just don't learn anything from most of this threads anymore, because i noticed the muslims except ajisafe don't even bother contributing to the posts. there's is too much venom, and hatred towards others, mostly by the christians but once you say anything you are dismissed as a terrorist. it's hard meeen, too many kid brains and too many myopic minds in da house.

now kill me.

You've really hit the nail on the head. God bless you. Those so-called Muslims don't want be tagged "terrorists." In some of my postings, I had told them to throw back unto the kufars whatever the kufars throw at them. If they call you "terrorists" tell them they and their sires are the BIG TERRORISTS! If possible yell! You cannot be soft with the kufars. Believe me.


@zarah

I see the writer before ajisafe asking if Muhammad ever killed anybody, maybe too harshly but it was a question. And your friend Ajisafe let out such a diatribe on Jesus that I was kind of set back at how vehemently he insulted another religion.

"Believer in an eye for an eye like the Christians" Go read the new testament dear  since you are quoting that from the old.

Your name, Ajadudu (black dog), is an unfortunate name in Yoruba. Only the accursed ones -- the abiku (stillborn) are named so. And now (here on nairaland); unfortunately, you're living up to your doomed name. If you were not so myopic in your bigoted judgment, you'd see that that fool, mrlawng, lied that Ahmadinejad used the Qur'an as the basis to justify his utterances. Also, you need to go through this animal's postings before you open your dirty mouth again.

If you know Ajisafe very well, you'd see he is very fond of attacking people when they do not agree with his own point of view, especially when it comes to religious matters. As a matter of fact, he once attacked his own fellow muslims on one thread, simply for telling him the truth about himself. He is not worth calling a muslim at all.

Bad guy, you're millions of miles away from being a "goodguy." You're a buffoon and a liar. You are the one unworthy of being called a christian. Remember, not too long ago, your fellow christians openly said that you were never a christian. Why? Because you're a "cele." Since "'Celes" are known to be idol-worshippers, your fellow christians rightly defrocked and disowned you an ignoble idol-worshipper!

Therefore, it would not be wise to conclude that Christians on this forum hate the muslims, as Ajisafe is usually the only person involved in such Christian-Muslim attacks, from the muslim side. That alone should tell you the kind of person he is.

Again, you're a lying bastard! The christians on this forum really hate the Muslims -- it's so glaring. Lying "Cele" -- "juju man," medicine man. The kind of person that I am is one that whoops your idol-worshipping behind!

Afterall, nuru and kenya are muslims too but we've never had problems with them.

I have given you the reasons why.

Look, I have nothing against Nuru, but he and other Muslims (brothers and sisters) like him need to come out and defend the Deen openly. There's nothing for them to gain in self-aggrandizement or worse, the kufars glorifying them so as to pitch them against their brother (who is only here to check the excesses of the kufars). Remember, during Ramaddan, if, for a reason, you're unable to fast, your expiation is to feed and make comfortable those needy and fasting Muslims. The same goes for Jihad -- if you're so timid and scared that you can't do jihad, and unable to aid those who are doing it, do yourself a favor by not putting difficulties in their way.

I patiently await Ajisafe's response to my post.

You've just got it, lying idol-worshipper! If you want more "venoms," bring it on!"

hmmmm,Ajisafe maybe i shld speak yoruba to you for you to finally accept, i'm a "sane" Nigerian.a yoruba(mi o kin se oyinbo!omo ile ni mi,i hope i got that rite,i can speak it but i'm pathetic in writin it) and i wouldnt say i'm mad at you for callin me a lunatic but i'll pray for you, evrytym i say my prayers.i'll pray that Allah helps broaden ur mind and if its my way thats wrong, he broadens mine and other muslims.blive me, i have enuff sins,nobody is perfect.without addin an aggressive disagreement with a muslim. i'm sorry if i ever called you names but i would like you to broaden ur mind, u know i used to be a very impatient person b4, gettin angry over no reason etc but i adopted something, its called a desiderata,it was found in a church,st pauls parish(i can imagine the smirk on ur face seein the word church-the author isnt known) as my mantra and do you know its worked miracles for me, that and the fact that i have a better relationship with God(Allah,just to clear things).
like i said( b4 u started insultin me) i admire ur passion for islam and if u would just use it in a positive way, ignorin insults to you,like sahih al-bukhari has said “You do not do evil to those who do evil to you, but you deal with them with forgiveness and kindness.” (Sahih Al-Bukhari ) , u would win more souls in2 islam than counterin aggressiveness wit aggressiveness,like u've been doin, mind you i'm NOT judgin u cuz nobody is perfect and that brings anoda issue,stop callin muslim kufars or munafikins cuz u r sining, just cuz we dont agree to your method of jihad doesnt mean we r hypocrites, we just share different perspectives to an issue, its allowed rite? i mean the world would be a very BORING place if we were all programmed to have the same beliefs,thats why Allah created us with choices AND the brains to know rite choices frm wrng choices.
i'm tryin to make peace with you, accept my white flag.

i would love to paste desiderata here so u'll understnd why its my mantra. and b4 i do that,Mr Ajia23, I'M SO PROUD OF YOU! and i admire ur dedication,open mindedness and patience.may Allah bless you and make more muslims like you and BETTER. and the other muslims here too who have contributed their knowledge in one way or the other,may Allah make it easy for us(amin)

                     [b]                                 Desiderata


Go placidly amid the noise and the haste, and remember what peace there may be in silence. As far as possible without surrender be on good terms with all persons. Speak your truth quietly and clearly; and listen to others, even to the dull and the ignorant, they too have their story. Avoid loud and aggressive persons, they are vexations to the spirit.


If you compare yourself with others, you may become vain or bitter; for always there will be greater and lesser persons than yourself. Enjoy your achievements as well as your plans. Keep interested in your own career, however humble; it is a real possession in the changing fortunes of time.


Exercise caution in your business affairs, for the world is full of trickery. But let not this blind you to what virtue there is; many persons strive for high ideals, and everywhere life is full of heroism. Be yourself. Especially do not feign affection. Neither be cynical about love; for in the face of all aridity and disenchantment it is as perennial as the grass. Take kindly the counsel of the years, gracefully surrendering the things of youth.


Nurture strength of spirit to shield you in sudden misfortune. But do not distress yourself with dark imaginings. Many fears are born of fatigue and loneliness. Beyond a wholesome discipline, be gentle with yourself. You are a child of the universe, no less than the trees and the stars; you have a right to be here. And whether or not it is clear to you, no doubt the universe is unfolding as it should.


Therefore, be at peace with God, whatever you conceive Him to be. And whatever your labors and aspirations in the noisy confusion of life, keep peace in your soul. With all its sham, drudgery and broken dreams; it is still a beautiful world. Be cheerful.


Strive to be happy.[/b]

these r words of wisdom.